The SD times has announced their ‘SD Times 100‘ for 2010. The SD Times recognizes top leaders and innovators of the software development industry. However upon looking at the list you’ll see two names that stick out like sore thumb: ‘Microsoft‘ and the ‘Mono Project‘.
How is Microsoft considered an innovator? They buy out companies and developers to produce their substandard software. They hired Anders Hejlsberg who was Chief Engineer at Borland who worked on Turbo Pascal and managed the team who made Delphi. He was used to corrupt the Java standard with J++ (leaving out Sun features). After that he was put in charge of creating C# when Microsoft was forced to start over after being sued by Sun for it’s dirty java tricks. When developing C# they basicly copied the innovation of Sun’s Java. Silverlight is a copy of Adobe’s innovation, and will be trumped with HTML5.
Upon inspection we came across an article on the SD Times website which was explaining what it was looking for in the SD Times 100 nominations which I will quote below:
The SD Times 100 looks for companies, non-commercial organizations, open-source projects and other influencers that have determined a direction that developers followed. Last year, 100 companies were recognized in 14 categories.
Source: SD Times 100 Nomination Announcement
I also have a problem with the Mono Project being on the list. What have they actually ‘created’ or ‘innovated’ up to now besides copying everying Microsoft has done? They haven’t determined any developer direction as C# has been slowly growing. In the TIOBE index its highest rating was 6.258% on December 2009 which has slowly grown from 0.384% since August 2001.
Mono is nothing but a copy of Microsoft’s C# language. Any direction in C# would be attributed to Microsoft only. They own both the standard and the patents based on it (including the non-ecma patents which only Novell can legally use in Mono).
Novell attributes the success of the Mono Project to the February 2009 launch of Moonlight 1.0, the September 2009 launch of MonoTouch 1.0, the November 2009 launch of Mono Tools for Visual Studio and the December 2009 launch of Moonlight 2. Source: Novell News.
Earth to Novell: Moonlight isn’t an innovation, it’s a copy of Silverlight. Silverlight isn’t even popular at all among developers (even Flash is more popular). Both technologies are hitting the backburner as HTML5 has been hitting the news more than Silverlight and Flash. The only thing historic about President Obama’s historic inauguration on Silverlight is that it’s the first time the public caught his lies about open technologies.
Other bad examples were MonoTouch and Mono Tools for Visual Studio. Did Apple not just recently ban stuff not written in C/C++ or Objective C? How great can Mono Tools be to the world when C# is only 6.258% on TRIOBE? and it’s an addon for someone elses innovation?
In the end i’m not totally surprised. The article mentioned the use of Twitter which means that people were gaming the system in favour of MSFT and Mono by ganging up together to retweet Mono-related news.
I wonder what we will see from Microsoft and the Mono Project in the future. Perhaps this will entice them to actually innovate? Much like Obama’s ‘Call to Action’, where receiving the nobel peace prize inspired him to work harder. We can only wait and see.
[...] This post was mentioned on Twitter by Altas DX, Altas DX. Altas DX said: If Mono innovates then I'm the King of Canada http://bit.ly/d4sAav [...]
mono SIMD is one example of innovation. With regards to the TIOBE index. mono supports multiple languages. Secondly, if we disqualify C# for being number 6 then we must also disqualify every language below it
Greetings your Majesty.
They developed new stuff that are not in .NET and are used in the real world. I think you have no deeper knowledge of mono and what is happening to have the right to talk about it like that
The above comment is very funny and witty
Then you are a Queen and as all royalties you are a dumb cunt!
Mono’s Cecil linker is also an innovation. It’s very powerful. More powerful than anything Microsoft has implemented in this space.
Mono also created a working plugin API before Microsoft (Mono.Addins came out long before Microsoft Extension Framework (MEF))
Even if Apple stops accepting MonoTouch apps (they are still accepting them so far, btw), it doesn’t make MonoTouch non-innovative.
Mono also innovated with creating a REPL which Microsoft is now trying desperately to copy for .NET 5 (due out in 2 years).
Based on this, it would appear you need to do some better research before you spout off about things you are so obviously clueless about.
Right on point. Just like most MS technologies only people that are wrapped up in the MS only world care about them. The rest of the greater tech world pays it no attention. The MS fans run around talking talking about the stuff as if it’s a standard but can hardly ever point to a major project or company using it. In their minds is a standard because they are usually ignorant of just about everything else and foolishly assume that just because they and the guy next to them use it that the whole world must be using it. I had one idiot try to tell me that neither Netbeans or Eclipse were that popular. Yet how can they not be when they are two of the standards for the worlds most popular language. Are folks writing Java in Visual Studio?
Mono has like 3 projects to its name on Linux, isn’t used widely at all and fails to be truly cross platform which waists point but its up for an award?
All Hail the King!
Your quote says nothing about innovation. As for the influence, Mono influenced some Linux developers to use C# (or other .NET based languages). And let’s not forget the popular Tomboy GNOME applet.
It seems to me that Microsoft doesn’t care what happens to C# and the whole dot.net environment. They are loosing interest in it. They have a long history of developing technologies and applications, sucking every possible dollar out of the revenue stream then abandoning it or mothballing it. Look at their history: VB, Access, MS Money …..
It seems they are now only interested in dot.net for what it does for SharePoint, their new number one revenue stream. SharePoint is Microsoft’s new white knight and dot.net and all the poor developers that spent years learning their trade will be brushed aside once again.
Mono is a copy of dot.Net, and Moonlight is a copy of Silverlight. Even if you accept the premise that dot.Net and Silverlight are innovative products, Mono and Moonlight simply cannot be.
In reality, dot.Net is a copy of Java, except that it does not copy the main point of Java, which is to be a cross platform software environment.
‘They wouldn’t let us turn Java into a Microsoft only environment like we wanted. I know! Let’s just make our own Microsoft only, non-cross platform, cross platform software environment!’ How innovative.
There is a point you could make here about dot.Net. That point is that dot.Net supports multiple languages, and Java doesn’t. Of course, Microsoft was not the first to come up with the idea of supporting multiple languages with a virtual machine software environment, but they were the first to produce a widespread working implementation of it.
Until dot.Net applications can actually be made to run on Mono, dot.Net will still not be a cross platform software environment. In other words dot.Net is just a glorified Microsoft 4GL platform, like Visual Basic and Visual FoxPro before it, that also supports multiple languages. As I said, that is its most innovative feature.
Silverlight is a straight out copy of Flash. In some ways it is better implemented, but there is nothing innovative about it that I’ve seen.
@jjabrams @Cristian @simion314 – The fact that mono enhances .NET is moot, .NET is a failure. Adding to a failure doesn’t make it any better, doesn’t enhance the dev community, and it doesn’t drive .NET (Microsoft does). They do nothing for C# that the majority of C# developers can put to use – as most use Visual Studio and it will be missing these enhancements.
Linux developers don’t use C#, only Windows developers who think they are Linux developers do this. Gnome is mostly C (what hasn’t been corrupted with mono), KDE is mostly C++.
Out of Miguel’s creations, Mono is the least innovative.
I believe the confusion may be the result of your adhering to an outdated definition of “innovation”. It used to mean the creation of something new and unprecedented; now it means, “marketing slapped some fresh lipstick on this pig”.
I hope that clears things up.
[...] shamelessly) and gets named for it, is giving Mono the lip service Novell craves so much (rebuttal here). According to the comments in Linux Today, people do not welcome the Mono applications that Novell [...]
@ #12
“It’s like being the smartest kid with down-syndrome”
Well, I’m not saying Mono innovates, but at this point I’d be happy if they did. Because really, I don’t know you from Stallman, but on average I’m pretty sure you as king would be an improvement on our current government.
Your quote says nothing about innovation. As for the influence, Mono influenced some Linux developers to use C# (or other .NET based languages). And let’s not forget the popular Tomboy GNOME applet.
>
>
Umm…Tomboy is *PAST HISTORY* as of Fedora 13
Which really says just how “popular” Tomboy really was as far Fedora was concerned
I am in complete agreement with #11 written by C.Whitman
if you dont like mono, fork it, its GPL, python ftw
Really. They are still interested in dot.net don’t you worry. VB has migrated to dot.net. Access, well, now a days with SQL Server what’s the point. And Money, it was a business decision, they tried to take QBook and they fail, why keep putting money in it.
I am a registered developer with Microsoft (anybody can be, nothing special here), and I got VS2010 Pro, SQL and Win2008Web for free. I don’t see them making money here; that’s right they don’t make money anymore…
C# evolves, Java stagnates. TIOBE index for C# is on steady raise, for Java it is on steady decline. C# is nicely integrated with Windows and this alone is a huge advantage over Java on Windows. Silverlight can provide, at least theoretically, both safe and rich Web applications.
Re: “Silverlight is a copy of Adobe’s innovation, and will
be trumped with HTML5.” Funny ignorance, possibly inspired by other equally competent media publications. Silverlight domain does intersect a bit with HTML5 (or 6, 7, etc.), but only Java FX could trump it but evidently failed to do so.
So, C# is good, at least for Windows in corporate environment.
As for Mono, I guess they are doing what they should do: learn and copy from Microsoft, which is evidently bigger and stronger, and adopt to their world. BTW, .NET is not cross platform, while Mono is.
@juancarlospaco – Mono is NOT GPL, I read the announcement from the Mono Project when they removed all the GPL code (it’s in their news section).
Release Notes Mono 2.6 and Mono Develop 2.2
It seems you need to read the announcement again. The part about removing all the GPL code is for Mono Develop not Mono.
@nimda – You’re correct actually, C# in Mono itself is dual licensed MIT/X11 and GPL. Various other parts are dual licensed with GPL. ASP.NET parts are licensed under the Microsoft Permissive License. The Mono Project has no qualms selling you a version of the source which you can keep closed/proprietary.
Quick show of hands from everyone on this thread who has actually contributed even a single line code to any FOSS project at any point in their life? Anyone?
Forget about innovation. Just write something, anything. Better yet, download a tarball and learn how to compile/install something.
@turtlewax – common ad hominem attack used by Mono Boosters. Do you have the Novell playbook?
“You don’t contribute code? Oh then you have no right to an opinion”
Which is amusing, how many art critics can paint masterpieces themselves?
>>Which is amusing, how many art critics can paint
>>masterpieces themselves?
That’s kind of the point, Ellsworth Toohey. You can drive a Hummer and lambaste BP. You can bash on MS while surfing in IE. But yes, if I’m soliciting opinions, I definitely place more value in people who are doing actual work. But I suppose they wouldn’t bother with this thread.
@turtlewax – By placing value in those doing actual work you’re getting an extremely biased opinion. Of course they will say their tools are the best, they write C# code for a living. Doing research means using multiple sources and when you do you’ll notice people aren’t raving about .NET anything unless they are already in that field. People doing actual work are using mostly C and Java (with C recently having made a comeback to #1). Ever ask a C or Java coder what they think of Mono Tools for Visual Basic? or Visual Basic itself? or .NET ?
Running .a .NET solution for their trading application the London Stock Exchange paid over $1 BILLION to find out how fast and stable .NET is. After crash of the .NET solution the LSE replacement solution was to BUY the firm which made a better product built on top of Linux and now they are installing it to replace the .NET “solution” written by Microsoft and one of its British partners. IF Microsoft can’t write an trading applications which is BOTH fast and stable who can? Microsoft has, after all, private and total access to documentation for both .NET and Windows.
One person chastising another for criticizing Mono wrote that Mono is good because it allows running .NET application on Linux. If nothing else that is an admission that running .NET applications on Windows is neither fast nor stable, but it also begs the question I ask on all of my postings:.
“If Windows API becomes the default on Linux then what is the point of Linux?” — Mark Shuttlesworth
MONO is Windows API
>>By placing value in those doing actual work you’re >>getting an extremely biased opinion. Of course they
>>will say their tools are the best, they write C# code for
>>a living
I said “work”, and somehow you assumed “work in C#”.
I said “any FOSS project”, and somehow you assumed “mono”.
>>Ever ask a C or Java coder what they think of Mono
>>Tools?
I just did, but you’re so wrapped around this issue its clouded your ability to read simple sentences. Passion is good, admin, and you clearly have a lot of it. Channel it into something constructive. Seriously, write some code. You choose the language.
@turtlewax – I contribute to the Fedora project actually, I’m trying to become a packager – currently I’m in the process of learning how to make RPMs and I have a list of packages that need maintainers. You’ll see a lot more of me soon enough. As for writing code I’m still learning, not much I can contribute in that area.
>>I contribute to the Fedora project actually, I’m trying to
>>become a package
That’s good work too. Any involvement is good. My comments about contributing were too narrow in focus.
Mono… BAH!
It seems to me that mono is a result of Novell’s deal with the devil, and part of the hellspawn that erupted from that pustule.
Mono just gives me another reason not to use the GNOME desktop environment. I make damn certain that I do not install anything with mono dependencies on any of my systems. (I even have a daily cron to check for mono libraries that I may have missed).
Mono is like the first set of zombies, if we stop it in the beginning then we can avoid the zombie apocalypse.
GUADEC? Why would I go to a conference that’s pro gnome? I consider KDE to be a far superior platform.
I went to FUDCon in Toronto last year (got my free T-shirt too) and right now I’m working with Fedora on various venues, including helping new users with KDE. I’ve signed a CLA with them, now I just need a package sponsor. I’ve contributed to Wikipedia, I’ve contributed to Fedora and I will be contributing to the Google Go project with word of mouth, rpm packages of various apps and support.
Perhaps you’re the one who needs to get a life and stop stalking my blog.
Dave,
I’ve probably left about 5 comments on boycott-boycottnovell, boycottboycottnovell and freeishsoftware (all the same sites).
I’ve sent less than five e-mails to the parties you mentioned. I can back this up with googles records, I use google apps for domains.
Your definition of “criminal harassment of my family” means: e-mailing your wife twice about your vandetta with mr king of aliases nath where you published porn of him – and still do.
Your definition of “trolling press releases” means: e-mailing access and limo PR reps for a comment on you clearly defining rms as a rapist while on a businesx trip. They had no comment by the way. They had a chance to distance themselves by saying it was done on your personal time.
Clearly ‘your job’ includes the use of social media to make free software and its more vocal supporters look bad in the name of exploitable open source.
Dave, buddy, my blog hardly mentions you but you find the time to libel me on every post – but i’m the stalker..
PS: I might go to Akademy if its ever in driving distance of Toronto